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Re: ccbc-net digest: May 07, 2014
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From: Vicki Cobb <vicki.cobb2_at_verizon.net>
Date: Thu, 08 May 2014 08:35:12 -0400
You might be interested in Susan Kuklin's treatment of this subject in her book Beyond Magenta: Transgender Teens Speak Out. I revied it for the Huffington Post: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/vicki-cobb/gender-identity-is-not-wh_b_4770038.html
Vicki Cobb
----- Original Message ----- From: "CCBC-Net digest" <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> To: "ccbc-net digest recipients" <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2014 1:21 AM Subject: ccbc-net digest: May 07, 2014
CCBC-NET Digest for Wednesday, May 07, 2014.
1. Trans vs cross dressing 2. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 3. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 4. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 5. Trans/Cross-Dressing 6. Humor and Non-Conformity and Other Things 7. Pink & Sparkly/Girls in Pants 8. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 9. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 10. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 11. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 12. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 13. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 14. Cross Dressing as Girls 15. Trans vs. cross-dressing 16. new picture book re: transgender child 17. Re: new picture book re: transgender child 18. RE: Cross Dressing as Girls 19. Almost Perfect by Brian Katcher 20. The Paper Bag Princess 21. Title Correction 22. Nontraditional Princesses 23. Re: Cross Dressing as Girls 24. Re: Cross Dressing as Girls 25. RE: Cross Dressing as Girls
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Trans vs cross dressing From: "Kathleen T.Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 08:54:32 -0500 X-Message-Number: 1
Several people have mentioned picture books about boys who want to wear dresses. Some, such as Marcus Ewert's "10,000 Dresses" depict a transgender child, by showing a young boy who feels he was born into the wrong body. Most trans adults say they were aware of this sense of being in the wrong body from a very early age. This year's books, "Morris Micklewhite and the Tangerine Dress" and "Joshua's New Dress" leave things open to interpretation. The main characters could either be trans of gender fluid, or simply like to wear dresses.
It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes, and girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable books about girls, let us know.)
-KT
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: Gjb71563 <gjb71563_at_aol.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:15:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Message-Number: 2
I think it is more socially acceptable for girls to be "tomboys" and wear boy-like clothes; whereas, boys wearing dresses is really frowned upon. This is evident in the father's reaction to his son in Jacob's New Dress (not Joshua). The book is honest and well done. Perhaps this is why there is the emphasis of having books with boy characters.
Gail Brown Voorheesville Public Library
-----Original Message----- From: Kathleen T.Horning <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> To: CCBC-Net Network <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Sent: Wed, May 7, 2014 9:57 am Subject: [ccbc-net] Trans vs cross dressing
Several people have mentioned picture books about boys who want to wear dresses. Some, such as Marcus Ewert's "10,000 Dresses" depict a transgender child, by showing a young boy who feels he was born into the wrong body. Most trans adults say they were aware of this sense of being in the wrong body from a very early age. This year's books, "Morris Micklewhite and the Tangerine Dress" and
"Joshua's New Dress" leave things open to interpretation. The main characters could either be trans of gender fluid, or simply like to wear dresses.
It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes, and girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable books about girls, let us know.)
-KT
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Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: "goldschp tds.net" <goldschp_at_tds.net> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 09:36:41 -0500 X-Message-Number: 3
Maybe because a girl who wants to wear boy's clothes doesn't elicit the widespread condemnation that boys wanted to wear dresses (and play with dolls) elicit? It's harder to write a dramatic story about a modern girl who doesn't like to wear (or do) "girlish" things, because society accepts
(in a relative sense) that girls don't always have to fit that mold. But people have a much bigger problem with boys in frilly dresses, so it makes for a more interesting story.
When I was growing up (in the 70s), there was a book about an Edwardian-era girl who wanted to wear pants, but her parents solved her demand by letting her wear a sailor-suit dress.
Paul Goldschmidt
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 8:54 AM, Kathleen T.Horning < horning_at_education.wisc.edu> wrote:
> It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even
> though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes,
> and
> girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong
> body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable
> books about girls, let us know.)
>
> -KT
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: Katelyn Browne <kbrowne_at_ccpcs.org> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:01:31 -0400 X-Message-Number: 4
I agree with Paul that at a societal level, people are much more accepting of girls in pants than of boys in dresses. However, I had a request last year from a first grade teacher: one of her female students was being teased about "being a boy"/"not really being a girl" because she always wore pants/shorts and t-shirts, and none of them were pink/sparkly. (In fact, her style is pretty similar to her older brother's.)
I was really surprised by how hard it was to find picture books with girl characters who were never pictured wearing a dress or a skirt. Even as adults rarely question girls in pants about their gender identity, picture books seem very reliant on skirts as an indicator of "girl."
Of course, this is just my anecdotal experience; I'd love to look into this more quantitatively when I have time.
--Katelyn.
Katelyn Browne Middle/High School Librarian Capital City Public Charter School 100 Peabody Street NW Washington, DC 20011
(202) 387-0309 x1745 kbrowne_at_ccpcs.org http://www.ccpcs.org/library/
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 10:36 AM, goldschp tds.net <goldschp_at_tds.net> wrote:
> Maybe because a girl who wants to wear boy's clothes doesn't elicit the
> widespread condemnation that boys wanted to wear dresses (and play with
> dolls) elicit?
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:07:26 -0400 X-Message-Number: 5
Concurring with what Paul said, I asked my husband, a cultural anthropologist who has worked with youth around issues of masculinity, to share his thoughts. His informed opinion is that its about hierarchy and the expectation that men are supposed to be superior to women. He thinks that when boys and men want to be be-like/dress-like women, it's a much greater threat to the social order than when girls and women want to be-like/dress-like men.
Julie Corsaro
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Humor and Non-Conformity and Other Things From: Megan Schliesman <schliesman_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:15:47 -0500 X-Message-Number: 6
I'm so glad Crystal mentioned "The Boy in the Dress" by David Walliams. It's such a a wonderful read, and a great example of how humor can be used to explore topics that challenge comfort zones, at least for some readers. (And one whole dimension of how this topic plays out in the real world is to what extent kids' responses may be informed by the adults in their lives.) She mentioned the "unbelievable" ending of the book. I always think of endings like that in books exploring topics that push against the comfort zones of readers and society, endings where everything turns out better than we might imagine, model the world as we wish it were. It was an ending with intent, and worked in the spirit of the book as a whole, staying true to the humor and warmth.
"Stitches," which Merri brought up, also has humor, but at the same time acknowledges, as Merri noted, much harsher realities, which perhaps made it a little harder to find its audience, although I hope it has and continues to do so. (I was surprised it wasn't on more best-of-the-year lists when it came out)
These are examples of books that are up front in their exploration of gender conformity. There are also more subtle examples. One of my favorite picture books that has nothing to do with gender specifically but to my mind affirms identity issues when it comes to a character knowing something true about himself that pushes against others' expectations is Rachel Vail's "Piggy Bunny."
Regarding picture books with Girls in Pants (now a running bibliography title in my head): this is perhaps an area where we still at the visiblity stage, with books that do exist not necessarily having anything to do with gender nonconformity but still allowing for some dimension of affirmation. So we'll take girls wearning pants for now while we wait for the female equivalent of "Morris MIcklewhite." ( I keep telling msyelf, "well, of course picture books with girls in pants exist," and they surely do, but perhaps not as many as I envision in my head.)
Megan
Date: Thu, 08 May 2014 08:35:12 -0400
You might be interested in Susan Kuklin's treatment of this subject in her book Beyond Magenta: Transgender Teens Speak Out. I revied it for the Huffington Post: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/vicki-cobb/gender-identity-is-not-wh_b_4770038.html
Vicki Cobb
----- Original Message ----- From: "CCBC-Net digest" <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> To: "ccbc-net digest recipients" <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2014 1:21 AM Subject: ccbc-net digest: May 07, 2014
CCBC-NET Digest for Wednesday, May 07, 2014.
1. Trans vs cross dressing 2. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 3. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 4. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 5. Trans/Cross-Dressing 6. Humor and Non-Conformity and Other Things 7. Pink & Sparkly/Girls in Pants 8. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 9. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 10. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 11. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 12. Re: Trans vs cross dressing 13. Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing 14. Cross Dressing as Girls 15. Trans vs. cross-dressing 16. new picture book re: transgender child 17. Re: new picture book re: transgender child 18. RE: Cross Dressing as Girls 19. Almost Perfect by Brian Katcher 20. The Paper Bag Princess 21. Title Correction 22. Nontraditional Princesses 23. Re: Cross Dressing as Girls 24. Re: Cross Dressing as Girls 25. RE: Cross Dressing as Girls
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Trans vs cross dressing From: "Kathleen T.Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 08:54:32 -0500 X-Message-Number: 1
Several people have mentioned picture books about boys who want to wear dresses. Some, such as Marcus Ewert's "10,000 Dresses" depict a transgender child, by showing a young boy who feels he was born into the wrong body. Most trans adults say they were aware of this sense of being in the wrong body from a very early age. This year's books, "Morris Micklewhite and the Tangerine Dress" and "Joshua's New Dress" leave things open to interpretation. The main characters could either be trans of gender fluid, or simply like to wear dresses.
It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes, and girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable books about girls, let us know.)
-KT
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: Gjb71563 <gjb71563_at_aol.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:15:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Message-Number: 2
I think it is more socially acceptable for girls to be "tomboys" and wear boy-like clothes; whereas, boys wearing dresses is really frowned upon. This is evident in the father's reaction to his son in Jacob's New Dress (not Joshua). The book is honest and well done. Perhaps this is why there is the emphasis of having books with boy characters.
Gail Brown Voorheesville Public Library
-----Original Message----- From: Kathleen T.Horning <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> To: CCBC-Net Network <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Sent: Wed, May 7, 2014 9:57 am Subject: [ccbc-net] Trans vs cross dressing
Several people have mentioned picture books about boys who want to wear dresses. Some, such as Marcus Ewert's "10,000 Dresses" depict a transgender child, by showing a young boy who feels he was born into the wrong body. Most trans adults say they were aware of this sense of being in the wrong body from a very early age. This year's books, "Morris Micklewhite and the Tangerine Dress" and
"Joshua's New Dress" leave things open to interpretation. The main characters could either be trans of gender fluid, or simply like to wear dresses.
It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes, and girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable books about girls, let us know.)
-KT
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To access the archives, go to...
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: "goldschp tds.net" <goldschp_at_tds.net> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 09:36:41 -0500 X-Message-Number: 3
Maybe because a girl who wants to wear boy's clothes doesn't elicit the widespread condemnation that boys wanted to wear dresses (and play with dolls) elicit? It's harder to write a dramatic story about a modern girl who doesn't like to wear (or do) "girlish" things, because society accepts
(in a relative sense) that girls don't always have to fit that mold. But people have a much bigger problem with boys in frilly dresses, so it makes for a more interesting story.
When I was growing up (in the 70s), there was a book about an Edwardian-era girl who wanted to wear pants, but her parents solved her demand by letting her wear a sailor-suit dress.
Paul Goldschmidt
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 8:54 AM, Kathleen T.Horning < horning_at_education.wisc.edu> wrote:
> It's interesting that to date all of these books deal with boys, even
> though there are also girls who hate wearing dresses and girly clothes,
> and
> girls who feel from an early age that they are truly boys in the wrong
> body. Why do you think this is? ( And if you can think of any comparable
> books about girls, let us know.)
>
> -KT
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: Katelyn Browne <kbrowne_at_ccpcs.org> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:01:31 -0400 X-Message-Number: 4
I agree with Paul that at a societal level, people are much more accepting of girls in pants than of boys in dresses. However, I had a request last year from a first grade teacher: one of her female students was being teased about "being a boy"/"not really being a girl" because she always wore pants/shorts and t-shirts, and none of them were pink/sparkly. (In fact, her style is pretty similar to her older brother's.)
I was really surprised by how hard it was to find picture books with girl characters who were never pictured wearing a dress or a skirt. Even as adults rarely question girls in pants about their gender identity, picture books seem very reliant on skirts as an indicator of "girl."
Of course, this is just my anecdotal experience; I'd love to look into this more quantitatively when I have time.
--Katelyn.
Katelyn Browne Middle/High School Librarian Capital City Public Charter School 100 Peabody Street NW Washington, DC 20011
(202) 387-0309 x1745 kbrowne_at_ccpcs.org http://www.ccpcs.org/library/
On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 10:36 AM, goldschp tds.net <goldschp_at_tds.net> wrote:
> Maybe because a girl who wants to wear boy's clothes doesn't elicit the
> widespread condemnation that boys wanted to wear dresses (and play with
> dolls) elicit?
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:07:26 -0400 X-Message-Number: 5
Concurring with what Paul said, I asked my husband, a cultural anthropologist who has worked with youth around issues of masculinity, to share his thoughts. His informed opinion is that its about hierarchy and the expectation that men are supposed to be superior to women. He thinks that when boys and men want to be be-like/dress-like women, it's a much greater threat to the social order than when girls and women want to be-like/dress-like men.
Julie Corsaro
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Humor and Non-Conformity and Other Things From: Megan Schliesman <schliesman_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:15:47 -0500 X-Message-Number: 6
I'm so glad Crystal mentioned "The Boy in the Dress" by David Walliams. It's such a a wonderful read, and a great example of how humor can be used to explore topics that challenge comfort zones, at least for some readers. (And one whole dimension of how this topic plays out in the real world is to what extent kids' responses may be informed by the adults in their lives.) She mentioned the "unbelievable" ending of the book. I always think of endings like that in books exploring topics that push against the comfort zones of readers and society, endings where everything turns out better than we might imagine, model the world as we wish it were. It was an ending with intent, and worked in the spirit of the book as a whole, staying true to the humor and warmth.
"Stitches," which Merri brought up, also has humor, but at the same time acknowledges, as Merri noted, much harsher realities, which perhaps made it a little harder to find its audience, although I hope it has and continues to do so. (I was surprised it wasn't on more best-of-the-year lists when it came out)
These are examples of books that are up front in their exploration of gender conformity. There are also more subtle examples. One of my favorite picture books that has nothing to do with gender specifically but to my mind affirms identity issues when it comes to a character knowing something true about himself that pushes against others' expectations is Rachel Vail's "Piggy Bunny."
Regarding picture books with Girls in Pants (now a running bibliography title in my head): this is perhaps an area where we still at the visiblity stage, with books that do exist not necessarily having anything to do with gender nonconformity but still allowing for some dimension of affirmation. So we'll take girls wearning pants for now while we wait for the female equivalent of "Morris MIcklewhite." ( I keep telling msyelf, "well, of course picture books with girls in pants exist," and they surely do, but perhaps not as many as I envision in my head.)
Megan
-- Megan Schliesman, Librarian Cooperative Children's Book Center School of Education, University of Wisconsin-Madison 600 N. Park Street, Room 4290 Madison, WI 53706 608/262-9503 schliesman_at_education.wisc.edu www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ My regular hours are T-F, 8-4:30. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Pink & Sparkly/Girls in Pants From: Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:33:52 -0400 X-Message-Number: 7 Not about any particular book, but perhaps going outside our comfort zone, we need to start shelving separately in libraries not only "pink and sparkly" picture books (presumably for girls but, of courses, anyone can check them out) but "girls in pants" books, too! Julie Corsaro ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: Thaddeus Andracki <tandracki_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 10:59:43 -0500 X-Message-Number: 8 With respect to Julie's point about maintaining hierarchies, I think it's interesting to consider what sociologists have begun referring to as "androcentrism," a hypothesis that the contemporary social order is more about privileging masculinity than males per se. There was a photo of James Franco in drag, lovely captioned with a pithy saying on the point: http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2011/06/12/androcentrism-its-okay-to-be-a-boy-but-being-a-girl/ I wonder if the relative lack of picture books that parallel Morris Micklewhite and Jacob's New Dress is because of a *perceived* surfeit of tomboys in children's literature. I think there's an assumption that "it's been done enough"???Little Women, Harriet the Spy, etc.???even though we're clearly struggling to come up with titles, especially for picture books. Two titles that don't quite exactly parallel but is worth mentioning at least, it seems, is Yolen's Not all Princesses Wear Pink and Bone's Not Every Princess. Cheers, Tad On 7 May 2014 10:07, Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> wrote: -- Thaddeus Andracki University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign Graduate School of Library and Information Science | MS Student Center for Children's Books | Outreach and Communications Coordinator *Bulletin of the Center for Children's Books* | Reviewer Undergraduate Library | Graduate Assistant ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: "K.T. Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:27:52 -0500 X-Message-Number: 9 Correction: the title I meant to write was Jacob's New Dress, not Joshua's --KT On 5/7/2014 8:54 AM, Kathleen T.Horning wrote: > Several people have mentioned picture books about boys who want to wear > dresses. Some, such as Marcus Ewert's "10,000 Dresses" depict a > transgender child, by showing a young boy who feels he was born into the > wrong body. Most trans adults say they were aware of this sense of being > in the wrong body from a very early age. This year's books, "Morris > Micklewhite and the Tangerine Dress" and "Joshua's New Dress" leave > things open to interpretation. The main characters could either be trans > of gender fluid, or simply like to wear dresses. > > > -KT > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: "K.T. Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:48:58 -0500 X-Message-Number: 10 Picking up on something Julie Corsaro said, and Tad echoed below -- it IS difficult to come up with picture books with girls who are not ultra-feminine. In fact, I would say that many picture books aimed especially at girls are pink and sparkly, a la "Fancy Nancy." It's as if the picture books themselves are dressing in ultra-feminine clothes. I'm sure many of you have seen your young female students, library patrons, or daughters gravitate toward the pink books, just as they do pink clothing. And yet, this is obviously learned behavior. (I heard an NPR report last week that said in earlier times, boys in Western societies were dressed in pink and girls in blue. Pink was a softer version of red, a robust, masculine color, and blue was considered peaceful and sedate.) There must be tremendous social pressure for girls to like pink. A contemporary picture book author/illustrator I can think of who always shows strong little girls in pants and colors other than pink is Molly Bang. I'm thinking of her book "When Sophie Gets Angry... Really, Really Angry" and a much earlier one called "Delphine." So while it may be easier for girls in our society to wear pants and colors other than pink, I don't think it's any easier for children born female who feel they are really boys inside. Or even for girls who don't like pink or dresses. --KT On 5/7/2014 10:59 AM, Thaddeus Andracki wrote: > I wonder if the relative lack of picture books that parallel Morris > Micklewhite and Jacob's New Dress is because of a /perceived/ surfeit > of tomboys in children's literature. I think there's an assumption > that "it's been done enough"???Little Women, Harriet the Spy, etc.???even > though we're clearly struggling to come up with titles, especially for > picture books. > > Two titles that don't quite exactly parallel but is worth mentioning > at least, it seems, is Yolen's Not all Princesses Wear Pink and Bone's > Not Every Princess. -- Kathleen T. Horning Director Cooperative Children's Book Center (CCBC) 4290 Helen C. White Hall 600 N. Park St Madison, WI 53706 http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc horning_at_education.wisc.edu 608-263-3721 (phone) 608-262-4933 (fax) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: Paula <pmorrow23_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 12:32:22 -0500 X-Message-Number: 11 But saying it's learned behavior doesn't explain why two sisters growing up in the same house with the same parents, stimuli, books, TV, and other influences can be polar opposites in this area. My 7-year-old granddaughter has been rough-and-tumble since infancy and is still all tomboy; her 5-year-old sister has always been attracted to bling and is now sparkly princess through and through. I've seen many similar contrasts in other families. At least part of it has to be innate. Paula On May 7, 2014, at 11:48 AM, K.T. Horning <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> wrote: > I'm sure many of you have seen your young female students, library > patrons, or daughters gravitate toward the pink books, just as they do > pink clothing. And yet, this is obviously learned behavior. (I heard an > NPR report last week that said in earlier times, boys in Western societies > were dressed in pink and girls in blue. Pink was a softer version of red, > a robust, masculine color, and blue was considered peaceful and sedate.) > There must be tremendous social pressure for girls to like pink. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans vs cross dressing From: Stacy Whitman <stacylwhitman_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 13:31:48 -0400 X-Message-Number: 12 This conversation reminds me of a real-life case about a girl attending a Christian school < http://www.cbsnews.com/news/christian-school-complains-8-year-old-girl-isnt-girly-enough/> who was reprimanded for "dressing like a boy" and having short hair. She's maybe 8 or 9 years old, and just likes more "boy"-oriented clothes (at this point, her grandmother who was raising her said, she doesn't feel like she's a boy in a girl's body or anything--she just prefers that style). But whether or not she identifies as trans, it's a story we don't see very often in books. I think there is a dearth of representation of girls who don't express gender norms in all media (as a girl who grew up hating dresses because of how impractical they were on our farm, I notice a lot how many girls are dressed in dresses in TV and movies) and of children born female who identify as trans/genderfluid. Stacy Whitman Publisher, Tu Books http://www.leeandlow.com/p/tu.mhtml ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Trans/Cross-Dressing From: pritchwitt_at_aol.com Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 13:51:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Message-Number: 13 I'm new to this list and haven't spoken up yet, but obviously this is a topic of great interest to me. My take is that the pink and frilly books are just a reflection of what's happening in society at large at the moment. As a fairly recent first-time grandmother, I am continually appalled by what I see in stores that sell clothing for infants and toddlers. Gone are green and yellow and red. It's all pink and purple (with sequins) on one side of the store and all brown and navy blue on the other. As though the need to label children as boy or girl is immediately meaningful or necessary. This was not the case when my own children were babies, and I wonder if the change is, at least partly, to do with the fact that so many people know the sex of their child before birth these days--they've already painted the nursery pink or blue and carried the color scheme on to every other aspect of the child's life. Which, of course, for the children whose minds tell them their gender doesn't conform to their bodies, makes it even harder to figure out who they are. I know, this has little to do with books, and I apologize for the rant. This topic is a hot one for me. Ellen Wittlinger author, Parrotfish, Hard Love and many other YA novels -----Original Message----- From: K.T. Horning <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Cc: CCBC-Net Network <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Sent: Wed, May 7, 2014 12:52 pm Subject: Re: [ccbc-net] Trans/Cross-Dressing Picking up on something Julie Corsaro said, and Tad echoed below -- it IS difficult to come up with picture books with girls who are not ultra-feminine. In fact, I would say that many picture books aimed especially at girls are pink and sparkly, a la "Fancy Nancy."?? It's as if the picture books themselves are dressing in ultra-feminine clothes. I'm sure many of you have seen your young female students, library patrons, or daughters gravitate toward the pink books, just as they do pink clothing. And yet, this is obviously learned behavior. (I heard an NPR report last week that said in earlier times, boys in Western societies were dressed in pink and girls in blue. Pink was a softer version of red, a robust, masculine color, and blue was considered peaceful and sedate.) There must be tremendous social pressure for girls to like pink. A contemporary picture book author/illustrator I can think of who always shows strong little girls in pants and colors other than pink is Molly Bang. I'm thinking of her book "When Sophie Gets Angry... Really, Really Angry" and a much earlier one called "Delphine." So while it may be easier for girls in our society to wear pants and colors other than pink, I don't think it's any easier for children born female who feel they are really boys inside. Or even for girls who don't like pink or dresses. --KT On 5/7/2014 10:59 AM, Thaddeus Andracki wrote: I wonder if the relative lack of picture books that parallel Morris Micklewhite and Jacob's New Dress is because of a perceived surfeit of tomboys in children's literature. I think there's an assumption that "it's been done enough"???Little Women, Harriet the Spy, etc.???even though we're clearly struggling to come up with titles, especially for picture books. Two titles that don't quite exactly parallel but is worth mentioning at least, it seems, is Yolen's Not all Princesses Wear Pink and Bone's Not Every Princess. -- Kathleen T. Horning Director Cooperative Children's Book Center (CCBC) 4290 Helen C. White Hall 600 N. Park St Madison, WI 53706 http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc horning_at_education.wisc.edu 608-263-3721 (phone) 608-262-4933 (fax) ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: pritchwitt_at_aol.com. To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp To access the archives, go to... http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net ...and enter the following when prompted... username: ccbc-net password: Look4Posts ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Cross Dressing as Girls From: Crystal Brunelle <brucr_at_onalaskaschools.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 12:52:35 -0500 X-Message-Number: 14 I have a hard time thinking of picture books where the focus is a girl rebelling against gender roles imposed by society or questioning the gender that they have been assigned. I do know a few that question or fight how girls are "supposed to" dress & behave: Princess Pigsty, Princess Knight & Pirate Girl. All three are by Cornelia Funke. A few chapter books come to mind such as Marty McGuire and Rickshaw Girl too though there are more. I think Julie and Paul have hit it though that a situation like that is somehow more acceptable in mainstream U.S. society so authors may not find that enough of a conflict. -- Crystal Brunelle Teacher Librarian Northern Hills Elementary 511 Spruce St. Onalaska, WI 54650 Tweet _at_librarygrl2 -- This email adheres to the policy of the School District of Onalaska <http://www.onalaska.k12.wi.us/email_policy.htm> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Trans vs. cross-dressing From: Kara Newhouse <kdnewhouse_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 13:58:58 -0400 X-Message-Number: 15 It's not a PB, but here's a great article by a teacher on supporting gender variance in the classroom. <http://www.rethinkingschools.org/archive/26_01/26_01_tempel.shtml> Starts with an example of a girl whose mother "braided her hair in cornrows because Allie thought it made her look like Will Smith's son, Trey, in the remake of The Karate Kid." -- *Kara Newhouse* *Education Reporter*Lancaster Newspapers *(717) 481-6013_at_KaraNewhouse <https://twitter.com/KaraNewhouse>* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: new picture book re: transgender child From: Jessica Herthel <jessica_herthel_at_hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 11:04:38 -0700 X-Message-Number: 16 Hello everyone, I'm new to this conversation but wanted to share the good news of our upcoming picture book about a transgender child, which will be published by Penguin Books in September: http://www.amazon.com/I-Am-Jazz-Jessica-Herthel/dp/0803741073/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1399485547&sr=8-1&keywords=I+am+jazz All proceeds will benefit the TransKids Purple Rainbow Foundation. Thanks! Jessica Herthel ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: new picture book re: transgender child From: "Kathleen T.Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 13:25:23 -0500 X-Message-Number: 17 Wow, thanks for letting us know about this forthcoming book, Jessica. I look forward to seeing it. And congrats! --KT > On May 7, 2014, at 1:04 PM, Jessica Herthel <jessica_herthel_at_hotmail.com> > wrote: > > Hello everyone, > I'm new to this conversation but wanted to share the good news of our > upcoming picture book about a transgender child, which will be published > by Penguin Books in September: > > http://www.amazon.com/I-Am-Jazz-Jessica-Herthel/dp/0803741073/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1399485547&sr=8-1&keywords=I+am+jazz > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: RE: Cross Dressing as Girls From: Katie Hutchison <khutchison_at_walsh.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 18:36:59 +0000 X-Message-Number: 18 A picture book I thought of that has a female character rebelling against traditional gender is Kiss Me! (I???m a Prince) by Heather McLeod. The main character, Ella, meets a prince that has been turned into a frog but decides she would rather play with a cool talking frog than have to be a frilly princess. So she doesn???t kiss him! Katie Hutchison Assistant Librarian Walsh University 2020 East Maple St. North Canton, OH 44720 Khutchison_at_walsh.edu<mailto:Khutchison@walsh.edu> (330) 244.4968 From: Crystal Brunelle [mailto:brucr_at_onalaskaschools.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 1:53 PM To: ccbc-net ccbc-net Subject: [ccbc-net] Cross Dressing as Girls I have a hard time thinking of picture books where the focus is a girl rebelling against gender roles imposed by society or questioning the gender that they have been assigned. I do know a few that question or fight how girls are "supposed to" dress & behave: Princess Pigsty, Princess Knight & Pirate Girl. All three are by Cornelia Funke. A few chapter books come to mind such as Marty McGuire and Rickshaw Girl too though there are more. I think Julie and Paul have hit it though that a situation like that is somehow more acceptable in mainstream U.S. society so authors may not find that enough of a conflict. -- Crystal Brunelle Teacher Librarian Northern Hills Elementary 511 Spruce St. Onalaska, WI 54650 Tweet _at_librarygrl2 This email adheres to the policy of the School District of Onalaska <http://www.onalaska.k12.wi.us/email_policy.htm> ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: khutchison_at_walsh.edu<mailto:khutchison@walsh.edu>. To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu<mailto:ccbc-net@lists.wisc.edu> To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu<mailto:digest-ccbc-net@lists.wisc.edu> To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu<mailto:leave-ccbc-net@lists.wisc.edu> ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp To access the archives, go to... http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net ...and enter the following when prompted... username: ccbc-net password: Look4Posts ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Almost Perfect by Brian Katcher From: Beth Martin <BMartin_at_dce.k12.wi.us> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 13:41:01 -0500 X-Message-Number: 19 Although it is from 2009, this book helped educate me about transgender issues in a way that I will never forget. Here is part of a review I wrote for my local newspaper: Told from the perspective of 18 year old Logan Witherspoon, Almost Perfect, tells the story of Sage Hendricks, whom Logan meets when Sage moves to his small town with her family. Sage is different than anyone Logan has ever met. She is beautiful, smart and friendly and Logan falls for her immediately, even though she is unusually tall. But Logan gets mixed messages from Sage. Her family is extremely protective of her and won???t let her date, yet her younger sister has a boyfriend. In addition, she alone has been home schooled for the last several years. Logan is sure that she is hiding something. When Sage finally reveals her secret, that she is a transgender male, Logan reacts with anger. How could Sage have kept this from him? What does this revelation say about Logan and his own sexuality? Later, when he has had more time to think things over, Logan feels terrible about his reaction. He considers what life must be like for Sage, who feels trapped in the wrong body. Logan vows to remain her friend, but things become complicated as these two teens work through their feelings for each other. Katcher does an excellent job of capturing the emotions of both Logan and Sage as well as family members and others who become part of their story. Logan becomes a reluctant hero and Sage is a very believable character, thanks to the many personal stories of teens just like her that have been shared with the author. Katcher works facts about the transgender process such as hormone therapy and sex reassignment surgery into the plot and adds additional information at the end of the book for those who desire to know more. Winner of the Stonewall Young Adult Literature Award for an English language book that has exceptional merit relating to the gay/lesbian/bisexual/transgendered experience, Almost Perfect is the kind of book that could save lives when put in the hands of the right teen. It gets the information out there that we all should know. Beth Martin Library Media Coordinator DC Everest Middle School bmartin_at_dce.k12.wi.us 715-241-9700 ex.2320 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: The Paper Bag Princess From: Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 14:56:39 -0400 X-Message-Number: 20 Princesses seem to be a theme here, and there's also *The Paper Bag Princess* by Robert Munsch. (If you don't know it, don't hold the author's *I'll Always Love You* against it!). After a dragon destroys her castle and kidnaps her betrothed, Prince Ronald, Elizabeth dons a paper bag and sets out to rescue him. She defeats the dragon, but when Ronald disparages her appearance, Elizabeth decides she doesn't want to marry him after all. Humor was mentioned earlier and it's a funny and lively book that is great for storytelling, reading aloud and discussion. Julie Corsaro ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Title Correction From: Julie Corsaro <juliealsc_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 15:07:41 -0400 X-Message-Number: 21 My turn for a title correction: it's *Love You Foreve*r not I'll Always Love You. Julie ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Nontraditional Princesses From: "Kathleen T.Horning" <horning_at_education.wisc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 19:25:29 -0500 X-Message-Number: 22 Julie made the observation that we seemed to have a princess theme going. I'd like to carry it one step further and ask: Does every picture book about a girl who doesn't conform to traditional gender roles deal with a princess? Has "princess" become our definition of femininity? Is that what we expect traditional girls to aspire to, and no traditional girls to rebel against? What about girls who just don't like to play with dolls or jump rope (two activ= ities that bored me as a child)? I can think of 35-40 year old picture books from feminist presses such as A Train for Jane and In Christina's Toolbox, but are there any modern equivalents? --KT ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Cross Dressing as Girls From: Elisa Gall <elisamcclain_at_gmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 20:34:11 -0500 X-Message-Number: 23 I'm a big fan of *Nurse, Soldier, Spy: The Story of Sarah Edmonds, A Civil War Hero* by Marissa Moss (illus. John Hendrix). Edmonds was living as a man (Frank Thompson) long before he enrolled in the Union army, and later married a man and lived publicly as a female veteran. Moss explains these facts in a gripping but matter-of-fact narrative, and Hendrix's illustrations showcase nothing less than a strong, brave hero. The story is about a spy who just happens to be genderfluid-Sarah/Frank's gender identity is not the main conflict. In my experience, books like this open the doors for discussions about the gender spectrum and societal norms in general, and can help to build inclusivity in communities and classrooms. -Elisa Elisa Gall LS Librarian Latin School of Chicago 312.582.6294 I have a hard time thinking of picture books where the focus is a girl rebelling against gender roles imposed by society or questioning the gender that they have been assigned. I do know a few that question or fight how girls are "supposed to" dress & behave: Princess Pigsty, Princess Knight & Pirate Girl. All three are by Cornelia Funke. A few chapter books come to mind such as Marty McGuire and Rickshaw Girl too though there are more. I think Julie and Paul have hit it though that a situation like that is somehow more acceptable in mainstream U.S. society so authors may not find that enough of a conflict. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Cross Dressing as Girls From: DAJ <daj9999_at_yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 18:55:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Message-Number: 24 Pam Munoz Ryan's _Riding Freedom_ is a fictionalized account of the childhood and early adulthood of Charley Parkhurst, the first woman to vote in California, who lived most of his life as a man (stagecoach driver and farmer); indeed, though there is speculation about Parkhurst's birth name and parentage, actual evidence still seems elusive. Parkhurst has also been the subject of a picture book, now OP. DAJ 19th-Century Girls Series - http://www.readseries.com -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 5/7/14, Elisa Gall <elisamcclain_at_gmail.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [ccbc-net] Cross Dressing as Girls To: "ccbc-net ccbc-net" <ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu> Date: Wednesday, May 7, 2014, 9:34 PM I'm a big fan of Nurse, Soldier, Spy: The Story of Sarah Edmonds, A Civil War Hero by Marissa Moss (illus. John Hendrix). Edmonds was living as a man (Frank Thompson) long before he enrolled in the Union army, and later married a man and lived publicly as a female veteran. Moss explains these facts in a gripping but matter-of-fact narrative, and Hendrix's illustrations showcase nothing less than a strong, brave hero. The story is about a spy who just happens to be genderfluid-Sarah/Frank's gender identity is not the main conflict. In my experience, books like this open the doors for discussions about the gender spectrum and societal norms in general, and can help to build inclusivity in communities and classrooms. -Elisa Elisa Gall LS Librarian Latin School of Chicago 312.582.6294 I have a hard time thinking of picture books where the focus is a girl rebelling against gender roles imposed by society or questioning the gender that they have been assigned. I do know a few that question or fight how girls are "supposed to" dress & behave: Princess Pigsty, Princess Knight & Pirate Girl. All three are by Cornelia Funke. A few chapter books come to mind such as Marty McGuire and Rickshaw Girl too though there are more. I think Julie and Paul have hit it though that a situation like that is somehow more acceptable in mainstream U.S. society so authors may not find that enough of a conflict. -- ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: daj9999_at_yahoo.com. To post to the list, send message to... ??? ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... ??? digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... ??? leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... ??? http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp To access the archives, go to... ??? http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net ...and enter the following when prompted... ??? username: ccbc-net ??? password: Look4Posts ? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: RE: Cross Dressing as Girls From: Claudia Pearson <pearsoncrz_at_earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 21:19:03 -0500 (GMT-05:00) X-Message-Number: 25 PAPER BAG PRINCESS by MUnch? _Claudia Pearson_ -----Original Message----- From: Katie Hutchison Sent: May 7, 2014 1:36 PM To: 'ccbc-net ccbc-net' Subject: RE: [ccbc-net] Cross Dressing as Girls A picture book I thought of that has a female character rebelling against traditional gender is _Kiss Me! (I???m a Prince)_ by Heather McLeod. The main character, Ella, meets a prince that has been turned into a frog but decides she would rather play with a cool talking frog than have to be a frilly princess. So she doesn???t kiss him! Katie Hutchison Assistant Librarian Walsh University 2020 East Maple St. North Canton, OH 44720 Khutchison_at_walsh.edu[1] (330) 244.4968 *From:* Crystal Brunelle [mailto:brucr_at_onalaskaschools.com] *Sent:* Wednesday, May 07, 2014 1:53 PM *To:* ccbc-net ccbc-net *Subject:* [ccbc-net] Cross Dressing as Girls I have a hard time thinking of picture books where the focus is a girl rebelling against gender roles imposed by society or questioning the gender that they have been assigned. I do know a few that question or fight how girls are "supposed to" dress & behave: Princess Pigsty, Princess Knight & Pirate Girl. All three are by Cornelia Funke. A few chapter books come to mind such as Marty McGuire and Rickshaw Girl too though there are more. I think Julie and Paul have hit it though that a situation like that is somehow more acceptable in mainstream U.S. society so authors may not find that enough of a conflict. -- Crystal Brunelle Teacher Librarian Northern Hills Elementary 511 Spruce St. Onalaska, WI 54650 Tweet _at_librarygrl2 This email adheres to the policy of the School District of Onalaska <http://www.onalaska.k12.wi.us/email_policy.htm[2]> ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: khutchison_at_walsh.edu[3]. To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu[4] To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu[5] To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu[6] ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp[7] To access the archives, go to... http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net[8] ...and enter the following when prompted... username: ccbc-net password: Look4Posts ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: pearsoncrz_at_earthlink.net. To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. 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To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp To access the archives, go to... http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net ...and enter the following when prompted... username: ccbc-net password: Look4Posts ==== CCBC-Net Use ==== You are currently subscribed to ccbc-net as: ccbc-archive_at_post.education.wisc.edu. To post to the list, send message to... ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To receive messages in digest format, send a blank message to... digest-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu To unsubscribe, send a blank message to... leave-ccbc-net_at_lists.wisc.edu ==== CCBC-Net Archives ==== The CCBC-Net archives are available to all CCBC-Net listserv members. The archives are organized by month and year. A list of discussion topics (including month/year) is available at... http://www.education.wisc.edu/ccbc/ccbcnet/archives.asp To access the archives, go to... http://ccbc.education.wisc.edu/ccbc-net ...and enter the following when prompted... username: ccbc-net password: Look4PostsReceived on Thu 08 May 2014 07:35:53 AM CDT