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RE: "older" children's poetry for adults?/Instrumental vs Aesthetic poetry?
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From: Geary, Mark <Mark.Geary_at_dsu.edu>
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2014 04:05:19 +0000
Joyce,
I have been "lurking" on the list for a while, but wanted to throw out this concept before the month was done...
I think in addition to younger vs older children's poetry, there is also a gender factor...I discovered somewhat late in life that Kahil Gibran's prose and Kipling's poetry deeply appealed to me, and I think would have if I were in school, if I had been exposed to it. Which brings me to my next point, how can we get teachers to take the time to share poetry as part of their instructional process, when there are few multiple choice items on "the test" that deal with or address poetry?
I think from a teaching perspective, one can look at poetry as either (I know there are probably dozens more of classification schemas) instrumental and aesthetic. Instrumental poetry is poetry that (IMHO), while enjoyable, is used with intentionality to advance a purpose, or a story.
For instance, in the book Holes, the poem that helps point out Stanley's family sense of fatalism goes like this,
"If only, if only," the woodpecker sighs,
"the bark on the trees was as soft as the skies." And the wolf waits below, hungry and lonely. He cries to the moon, "if only if only."
However, when he meets Zero, and understands their families intertwined past, he gets a different version of the poem, which helps drive home his release from the "curse" or change in perspective. It goes like this:
If only, if only, the moon speaks no reply; Reflecting the sun and all that's gone by. Be strong my weary wolf, turn around boldly. Fly high, my baby bird, My angel, my only.
Notice the affirmations in the last two lines, "fly high my baby bird, My Angel, My Only". One can almost see the mother calling that out to her son. And the more positive connotation is also reflected in the vast improvement in Stanley's post curse circumstances.
I also see poetry as being a 21st century technology tool. Instrumental poetry can be a tool in helping students understand the timing aspect of video creation, a key 21st century skill. I wrote about that briefly in this article:
Not the Usual Suspects: Poetry and Graphic Novels as 21st Century Tools<http://www.homepages.dsu.edu/mgeary/vita/Not-the-Usual-Suspects-Geary2011.pdf>
I believe if we can "hook" more teachers into teaching poetry from the instrumental perspective, we might have a greater willingness on the part of both teachers and administrators to engage with poetry as part of the teaching process, either from a Common Core "deep read" perspective, or from a technology integration perspective.
While the purpose may vary from the typical aesthetic goals, the end result might be having more time spent in schools teaching and engaging with poetry.
If I am not burned as a heretic, I would like to hear your thoughts on this.
Mark Geary
________________________________ From: Joyce Sidman [joyce.sidman_at_gmail.com] Sent: Friday, April 25, 2014 7:17 PM To: ccbc-net Subject: [ccbc-net] "older" children's poetry for adults?
Nancy,
What an interesting and important point! I think many poets--and novelists--are not writing just for children when they write. In fact, I once heard Rainbow Rowell remark that she is careful never to say she "writes for teens" because that would mean that she doesn't write for everyone else, which she does. So many poetry books--like HOW I DISCOVERED POETRY (Marilyn Nelson), CROSSING STONES (Helen Frost), and ROOTS & BLUES (Arnold Adoff)--are great reading for any thoughtful person, young or old. What are the reasons they never reach adults? Here are a couple possibilities: 1) Many adults would never think of reading poetry, and 2) These books are not marketed to adults.
I can't really address why most adults don't read poetry--it is denser than prose and not to everyone's liking--but I do think many adult readers would enjoy books like the those I mentioned above, which are full of intelligence, emotion, and vivid details. If only adults were exposed to them! I can't count the number of times adults have come up to me holding one of my poetry books and exclaiming, "I know this is for children, but I picked it up because my child was reading it, and it's just so interesting!" I guess all children's authors have heard this at one time or another.
In the case of WHAT THE HEART KNOWS, I was very fortunate. Given its subject matter, Houghton Mifflin made a deliberate choice to design the book to appeal to adults as well as children, and I think they were successful. The term they used was "gift book." Would a different cover have appealed a bit more to teens? Perhaps. But the "gift" look of the book gave it a chance at wider readership.
As with some YA crossover novels, I wonder if "older" poetry books could be released with two covers, one for the teen market and one for adults?
Would love to hear others' thoughts on this.
Joyce
During this past decade adult readers have discovered the amazing quality of young adult books. We have "cross-over" novels; I ask if there are ways to make known the quality of young adult poetry?
Nancy Bo Flood
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Received on Fri 25 Apr 2014 11:05:50 PM CDT
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2014 04:05:19 +0000
Joyce,
I have been "lurking" on the list for a while, but wanted to throw out this concept before the month was done...
I think in addition to younger vs older children's poetry, there is also a gender factor...I discovered somewhat late in life that Kahil Gibran's prose and Kipling's poetry deeply appealed to me, and I think would have if I were in school, if I had been exposed to it. Which brings me to my next point, how can we get teachers to take the time to share poetry as part of their instructional process, when there are few multiple choice items on "the test" that deal with or address poetry?
I think from a teaching perspective, one can look at poetry as either (I know there are probably dozens more of classification schemas) instrumental and aesthetic. Instrumental poetry is poetry that (IMHO), while enjoyable, is used with intentionality to advance a purpose, or a story.
For instance, in the book Holes, the poem that helps point out Stanley's family sense of fatalism goes like this,
"If only, if only," the woodpecker sighs,
"the bark on the trees was as soft as the skies." And the wolf waits below, hungry and lonely. He cries to the moon, "if only if only."
However, when he meets Zero, and understands their families intertwined past, he gets a different version of the poem, which helps drive home his release from the "curse" or change in perspective. It goes like this:
If only, if only, the moon speaks no reply; Reflecting the sun and all that's gone by. Be strong my weary wolf, turn around boldly. Fly high, my baby bird, My angel, my only.
Notice the affirmations in the last two lines, "fly high my baby bird, My Angel, My Only". One can almost see the mother calling that out to her son. And the more positive connotation is also reflected in the vast improvement in Stanley's post curse circumstances.
I also see poetry as being a 21st century technology tool. Instrumental poetry can be a tool in helping students understand the timing aspect of video creation, a key 21st century skill. I wrote about that briefly in this article:
Not the Usual Suspects: Poetry and Graphic Novels as 21st Century Tools<http://www.homepages.dsu.edu/mgeary/vita/Not-the-Usual-Suspects-Geary2011.pdf>
I believe if we can "hook" more teachers into teaching poetry from the instrumental perspective, we might have a greater willingness on the part of both teachers and administrators to engage with poetry as part of the teaching process, either from a Common Core "deep read" perspective, or from a technology integration perspective.
While the purpose may vary from the typical aesthetic goals, the end result might be having more time spent in schools teaching and engaging with poetry.
If I am not burned as a heretic, I would like to hear your thoughts on this.
Mark Geary
________________________________ From: Joyce Sidman [joyce.sidman_at_gmail.com] Sent: Friday, April 25, 2014 7:17 PM To: ccbc-net Subject: [ccbc-net] "older" children's poetry for adults?
Nancy,
What an interesting and important point! I think many poets--and novelists--are not writing just for children when they write. In fact, I once heard Rainbow Rowell remark that she is careful never to say she "writes for teens" because that would mean that she doesn't write for everyone else, which she does. So many poetry books--like HOW I DISCOVERED POETRY (Marilyn Nelson), CROSSING STONES (Helen Frost), and ROOTS & BLUES (Arnold Adoff)--are great reading for any thoughtful person, young or old. What are the reasons they never reach adults? Here are a couple possibilities: 1) Many adults would never think of reading poetry, and 2) These books are not marketed to adults.
I can't really address why most adults don't read poetry--it is denser than prose and not to everyone's liking--but I do think many adult readers would enjoy books like the those I mentioned above, which are full of intelligence, emotion, and vivid details. If only adults were exposed to them! I can't count the number of times adults have come up to me holding one of my poetry books and exclaiming, "I know this is for children, but I picked it up because my child was reading it, and it's just so interesting!" I guess all children's authors have heard this at one time or another.
In the case of WHAT THE HEART KNOWS, I was very fortunate. Given its subject matter, Houghton Mifflin made a deliberate choice to design the book to appeal to adults as well as children, and I think they were successful. The term they used was "gift book." Would a different cover have appealed a bit more to teens? Perhaps. But the "gift" look of the book gave it a chance at wider readership.
As with some YA crossover novels, I wonder if "older" poetry books could be released with two covers, one for the teen market and one for adults?
Would love to hear others' thoughts on this.
Joyce
During this past decade adult readers have discovered the amazing quality of young adult books. We have "cross-over" novels; I ask if there are ways to make known the quality of young adult poetry?
Nancy Bo Flood
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Received on Fri 25 Apr 2014 11:05:50 PM CDT
