CCBC-Net Archives
[CCBC-Net] "Manipulative"
- Contemporary messages sorted: [ by date ] [ by subject ] [ by author ]
From: James Elliott <libraryjim>
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 10:14:56 -0400 (EDT)
I agree with Paul.
A book or author may convey a message WITHOUT being manipulative. MANIPULATIVE is one of those words with a loaded meaning, whether for good or ill, that carries a negative connotation. No one likes to be manipulated.
I do not think it is the right word to use in connection with children's and YA literature. Perhaps simply referring to the author's "point of view"?
Jim Elliott North Georgia
----- Original Message ----- From: Paul W Goldschmidt <goldschp at tds.net> To: Sally Miller <derbymiller at fuse.net>, ccbc-net <ccbc-net at ccbc.education.wisc.edu> Sent: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 09:38:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [CCBC-Net] "Manipulative"
Perhaps "educational" or "pedagogical" would get at the same meaning without being carrying the weight of "manipulative"?
-- Paul Goldschmidt
At 08:24 AM 7/20/2009, Sally Miller wrote:
> Do you think our discussion of The Hidden Adult might be
> getting a little skewed because of the negative implications and
> associations evoked by the word "manipulative"? As a writer of
> children's books, I was ready to take offense at the idea that my
> books might be "manipulative" in any way, but now that I've thought
> harder about Perry's arguments and the responses of others, I have
> to admit that my books too could be considered to be subtly
> manipulative; but not, I insist, because I had a conscious intent
> to change my young readers. Or did I? Some of you may remember
> Jacob and the Stranger, my second book; obviously I was in sympathy
> with young Jacob's propensity to put enjoyment of life ahead of the
> conscientious devotion to duty that characterized his neighbors.
> And in my last book, No Mush Today, am I not endorsing a child's
> sometime right to rebel?
> But I've always been more interested in words than theories.
> And "manipulative" is such an ugly, negative term. Its associations
> have strayed far from its primary, more innocent meaning of to
> handle skillfully. (Webster's Collegiate). For me it brings up
> visions of the wife or husband who gives or refuses sex or money in
> order to achieve ulterior ends. Or the child who has learned that
> temper tantrums in a public area may make an embarrassed parent
> give in to his demands.
> I can't think, though, of a more apt word that Perry might
> have used. (Can you?) So perhaps as we are reading and reflecting
> on the "hidden" adult, we can keep in the back of our minds a
> picture of our hapless authors blissfully unaware (for the most
> part) of the skillful way in which they are perhaps changing a
> child's perception of the world. Because, if we were completely
> aware of all the possible effects of our words, who would dare
> write? Sally Derby
_______________________________________________ CCBC-Net mailing list CCBC-Net at lists.education.wisc.edu Visit this link to read archives or to unsubscribe... http://lists.education.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/ccbc-net
Received on Mon 20 Jul 2009 09:14:56 AM CDT
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 10:14:56 -0400 (EDT)
I agree with Paul.
A book or author may convey a message WITHOUT being manipulative. MANIPULATIVE is one of those words with a loaded meaning, whether for good or ill, that carries a negative connotation. No one likes to be manipulated.
I do not think it is the right word to use in connection with children's and YA literature. Perhaps simply referring to the author's "point of view"?
Jim Elliott North Georgia
----- Original Message ----- From: Paul W Goldschmidt <goldschp at tds.net> To: Sally Miller <derbymiller at fuse.net>, ccbc-net <ccbc-net at ccbc.education.wisc.edu> Sent: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 09:38:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [CCBC-Net] "Manipulative"
Perhaps "educational" or "pedagogical" would get at the same meaning without being carrying the weight of "manipulative"?
-- Paul Goldschmidt
At 08:24 AM 7/20/2009, Sally Miller wrote:
> Do you think our discussion of The Hidden Adult might be
> getting a little skewed because of the negative implications and
> associations evoked by the word "manipulative"? As a writer of
> children's books, I was ready to take offense at the idea that my
> books might be "manipulative" in any way, but now that I've thought
> harder about Perry's arguments and the responses of others, I have
> to admit that my books too could be considered to be subtly
> manipulative; but not, I insist, because I had a conscious intent
> to change my young readers. Or did I? Some of you may remember
> Jacob and the Stranger, my second book; obviously I was in sympathy
> with young Jacob's propensity to put enjoyment of life ahead of the
> conscientious devotion to duty that characterized his neighbors.
> And in my last book, No Mush Today, am I not endorsing a child's
> sometime right to rebel?
> But I've always been more interested in words than theories.
> And "manipulative" is such an ugly, negative term. Its associations
> have strayed far from its primary, more innocent meaning of to
> handle skillfully. (Webster's Collegiate). For me it brings up
> visions of the wife or husband who gives or refuses sex or money in
> order to achieve ulterior ends. Or the child who has learned that
> temper tantrums in a public area may make an embarrassed parent
> give in to his demands.
> I can't think, though, of a more apt word that Perry might
> have used. (Can you?) So perhaps as we are reading and reflecting
> on the "hidden" adult, we can keep in the back of our minds a
> picture of our hapless authors blissfully unaware (for the most
> part) of the skillful way in which they are perhaps changing a
> child's perception of the world. Because, if we were completely
> aware of all the possible effects of our words, who would dare
> write? Sally Derby
_______________________________________________ CCBC-Net mailing list CCBC-Net at lists.education.wisc.edu Visit this link to read archives or to unsubscribe... http://lists.education.wisc.edu/mailman/listinfo/ccbc-net
Received on Mon 20 Jul 2009 09:14:56 AM CDT
